Saturday, November 06, 2010

"Indo-Russian Fifth Gen Fighter? Best Of Luck With That!"

Michael R. Griswold, director of advanced development programmes at Lockheed-Martin was in Delhi recently and met the press for an update on the company's offerings in the Indian MMRCA competition. He spoke at a time when there's been a measure of discussion on the web about the notion that India would do better to buy the F-35 instead of 126 fourth generation fighters. The suggestion was followed by the Defence Secretary outright debunking the possibility of India acquiring a fifth generation fighter other than the PAK_FA/FGFA. Well Mr Griswold said he wasn't equipped to talk about the F-35 for India, but couldn't resist a barb. Nobody can in the airplane business anymore. "The fifth generation JV with Russia? Yeah, well all I can say is best of luck with that," Griswold said.

Video grab courtesy SP's

30 comments :

Anonymous said...

well better luck hawking that over priced pile of junk, else where.

Anonymous said...

Is that a pun ?

dreamsout said...

so LM is afraid of something called as FGFA...!!!! lolzzzz

Anonymous said...

Mr Grisworld obviously has been an arrogant representative of Lockheed on a visit to India (One of his company's important customer). This statement of his may have ticked Lockheed off the competition without him realizing it.
Thanks Mr. Grisworld - you made our day. We never wanted F16s anyways - you just handed us over the final reason to knock your company off the competition.

MRUGEN said...

I'm not sure what Mr. Grisworld Meant by "Best Of Luck With that", does he undermine Indian-Russian Capabilities or he was just playing just as another mean business tactic to score quick points for his own company.

After all f-35 for India in long term isn't gonna be good as it will act as a killer for our local industries who are in dire need of defence orientation & experience to produce defence materials at all levels of various projects.

US won't budge on sharing critical technologies with us & shall trap us in it's web of CISMOA,LSA & BECA like agreements which seem unfair & nosy in their nature.

Thus it seems that F-35 would be more like a trap than a dedicated fighter for IN or IAF.

A fighter like MCA(Medium Combat Aircraft) can be configured to do the job of a f-35(along with stealth,super cruise etc.) which would give brains in our research institutes,academics the much required opportunity of potential building.

Rahul said...

Typical american mentality!!

Anonymous said...

LoL!! Cash trapped US Defense Industries can not cope well with billions of dollar being siphoned to arch-rival Russia. And as far as the ' Best of Luck' is concerned..probably we can wish him the same so that F-16N stands a chance in MMRCA.

- Bond

Anonymous said...

WELL ALL WE CAN SAY OF THE AMERICANS AND THEIR DRACONIAN AGREEMENTS - KHISIYANI BILLI KHAMBHA NOCHE. HA HA

Anonymous said...

Russia sure has basic Stealth tech for sure. US F-117 design took help from Yak corp design. From the pics of Russian jet it's very much obvious that this new jet is high on commonality of parts with flanker: Engines are same family as flanker, same landing gear & al. So this should be relatively low on cost with decent capability. US has a long history of superiority complex.

Anonymous said...

If we collaborate with the Russians, we will gain knowledge of aircraft design that is invaluable, even if this particular project is not a great success.

If we buy American, we will forever be their slaves.

Anonymous said...

Of course it will be success like Brahmos, SU-30MKI. Russians are not Americans, they value their partners specially India.

While US don't want to sell F-22 to anyone Russia jointly developing PAK FA which is ahead of it.

Anonymous said...

Seems like Mr. Griswold wants to undermine the FGFA/PAK-FA, so that he can market the F-35 later on in India.

I'd like him to fly in an F-35 against the FGFA when it's ready.

Anonymous said...

thanks

But we dont want that over priced, without any knowledge transfer, fancy toy.

Anonymous said...

Typical American arrogance.

Why don't they mention that an F-16 was shot down by a Greek Mirage-2000. And Pak F-16s ran away when they were locked on by Indian MiG-29s.

Although I understand that the F-16 being marketed to India is far superior to the above. But the fact is, it is an old plane and is awaiting decommissioning in it's country of origin.

Can we be expected to go in with that?

Anonymous said...

LM should know better as they took help from the Russians to build F35.
F35 is a stealth version of Russian Yak 141.Read this


"Following the announcement by the CIS that it could no longer fund development of the Yak-41M, Yakovlev immediately entered into discussions with several foreign partners who could help fund the program (a tactic they were also pursuing for development of the Yak-130 trainer, which was eventually developed in partnership with Aermacchi of Italy). Lockheed-Martin, which was in the process of developing the X-35 for the U.S. Joint Strike Fighter program, quickly stepped forward, and with their assistance 48-2 was displayed at the Farnborough Airshow in September 1992. Yakovlev announced that they had reached an agreement with Lockheed-Martin for funds of $385 to $400 million for three new prototypes and an additional static test aircraft to test improvements in design and avionics. Planned modifications for the proposed Yak-41M included an increase in STOL weight to 21,500 kg (47,400 lb). One of the prototypes would have been a dual-control trainer. Though no longer flyable, both 48-2 and 48-3 were exhibited at the 1993 Moscow airshow. The partnership began in late 1991, though it was not publicly revealed by Yakovlev until 6 September 1992, and was not revealed by Lockheed-Martin until June 1994.[1]" - Wikipedia.

Anonymous said...

Not good PR by Mr. Griswold. Will tick off people in India as another commenter pointed earlier here

Pratik Sawerdekar said...

Don't entirely know what he meant. If he meant that you can't make fighters via JV than what is the JSF? If he doubts the capabilities of India and Russia than he is wrong cuz up until the F-22 came up the Su-30 was the best fighter in the world and India made it even better. Oh ya, good luck with the F-35 Mr Griswold.

Anonymous said...

Arrogance before the mighty fall. LM should realize it is 2010!

Anonymous said...

to hell with the yanks..they are just jealous.....the PAK-FA will be a good plane...

Mr. Ra said...

F-35 is a red herring for all that the India is doing good in the field of defense.

After all why shall India purchase F-16 which has practically gone extinct like Mig-21 in the world of business or why shall India purchase F-35 which is practically as much futuristic as the T-50/FGFA in the world of business.

Whatever their similarities but one thing can be estimated clearly that FGFA is going to be superior than the F-35.

Anonymous said...

Typical Indians more than Typical Americans...-

-Indian

Anonymous said...

The F-35 Pilots? Best of luck to all of them when they come face to face with SU-30MKI's, Eurofighters and Rafales.

Anonymous said...

LM has designed 2 5th gen fighters. With Mr. Griswold's best wishes, we are now bound to succeed.

Gautam said...

He has a point. We've dilly-dallied over the FGFA agreement for years and the Russians have already started development on all the key areas(stealth shaping, composites, autopilot, radar, engines) without us. Calling it 'Indo-Russian' may be a misonomer at this point.

Given India's share in the PAK-FA/FGFA joint venture is only 25%, and limited to things like the navigation system and mission computer, if the US offers us a deal similar to the Israelis with us developing our own systems on it the F-35 may be an equally worthwhile acquisition.

As for the Defence Secretary, did he just discount the AMCA? Because the IAF IS looking at getting more than one fifth-gen fighter.

ArkAngel said...

That article by Ajai Shukla is an absolute joke! He should know that the Aussie defense experts fear that the F35 wouldnt stand a chance against the advanced flankers.
Is Shukla an expert? He's just a journo!

Even if we choose it we will probably get it after 2017. Also we forget about any offset agreements in choosing the F35.

About CISMOA, we should just sign the damn thing. What are we so afraid of? Why are we as an aspiring super power so bloody insecure? If we ever want to become even a regional power we need to dump a Non aligned movement mindset.
Grow up and so some b@lls FFS!

Anonymous said...

How's the MTA going? Been hearing "joint venture" with the Russians for the last 10 years or so...

How is the Saras project fairing? It started out as a "joint venture" b/w NAL and Myachishev (sp).

How's the integration of the Al-55I going with the IJT? Been hearing about its integration being imminent for the last couple of years now.

Even after decades of using Russian equipment like tanks, helos and fighters, when time came to design Indian stuff, the Indians chose Western partners: From tank drive train to helo engines to flight control software. ALL of it went to Western companies.

Maybe the best thing to have happened to India is that India knows Russian tech and when possible, steers well clear of it.

Anonymous said...

Oh Noes! How dare does anyone call into question the FGFA?!?

Don't they know it's the new deity and the LM bloke is outraging the sensitivities of the Russia Rakshaks?

Anonymous said...

Yankee arrogant bas***d!! Dont worry you have many American poodles left to wipe your behind by posting supportive coments on these forums!

YANKEE GO HOME

Gt said...

Here at 1:45PM we have a loyal Russian Commie dog spewing the usual anti-American BS and advocating his country's overpriced crap.

Gergely said...

"Why don't they mention that an F-16 was shot down by a Greek Mirage-2000..."

Cause it is a Franche multirole aircraft, not a russian one.

In the last 30year F1x series had very good odds against CCCP/russian made fighters.

exactly:
F16 100+ vs 0
F15 100+ vs 0

"well all I can say is best of luck with that"
u will need it.... :p