Friday, December 10, 2010

PHOTOS: India's 3rd Phalcon AWACS Lands In Israel


Photos Courtesy / Exclusive to Vayu Aerospace & Defence Review (VI/2010)

39 comments :

Hardik Patidar said...

what about the news of india's awacs shot down by chili-chickens?

shyam said...

When is India placing the order for 3 more of these beauties?

indian defence forum said...

while this is good news for india one must not forget that pakistan is in the process of acquiring 4 ZK03 AEW&C.... which are very very advanced & also advanced AWACS such us KJ-2000.

so we as indians should not unduly get elated at this news.....the situation is grimmer than you guys think

Capital P said...

rat race is the word..

Capital P said...

rat race is the word..

Gautam said...

When the hell is the MoD going to approve the order for 3 more Phalcons? Pakistan has ordered 4 Erieyes and 4 ZDK-03s. It's a crying shame that even Pakistan has more AWACS than us even though we ordered ours first. UPA bureaucracy...

Mr. Ra said...

Our Novator status must be expedited.

Mr. Ra said...

BTW in AWACS like matters the Israeli technology can be expected to be superior than the Chinese.

Anonymous said...

How good is India's AWACS compared with ZK03 AEW&C or KJ-2000?
Prasun, could you show some light on this? The thing is Pakistan will be having 4 Swedish Erieyes and 4+ ZK-03 and/or KJ200/0. So far India has ordered only 3 Phalcons. What is the ratio of performance of one Phalcon vs ZK03/Erieye/KJ-200/0?

Thank you.

Mr. Ra said...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IAI_Phalcon

http://militarystrat.wordpress.com/2010/11/13/zdk-03-pakistani-chinese-jointly-developed-awacs-fly/

Anonymous said...

Why landing in Israel instead of India? Did it lose its way?

aniket said...

Phalcon is more advanced than those pakis will have read wikipedia guys.

Anonymous said...

Guys, don't worry about ZK03 AEW&C or KJ-2000. Few years from now, when PAF will receive all these aircrafts, IAF will be having K-100, the 400 km range "Awacs Killer" air to air missile.

Gautam said...

Even if 1 Phalcon = 2 Erieyes or ZDK-03s, the fact is we have only three of these to cover both borders whereas the Pakistanis have 8 AWACS(equivalent to 4 Phalcons) to cover our Western border while the Chinese have 12 or more AWACS covering our Eastern border.

Our capability is sorely lacking... just because our MoD is too stingy to order the additional AWACS IAF has been crying for since 2006.

Anonymous said...

I can smell some Pakis here, like indian defence forum and Anon @12:32. get lost porkis

Anonymous said...

Some of the comments are so immature. If you can get the job done with one AC then why go for 10 just bcoz your neighbor has 5 of them? Doesn't this sounds like "mine is bigger than your's"? Also please remember these birds cost a ton. If we keep splurging on "defense" then we will have nothing to eat. We have missile silos but ironically no grain silos which led to more than 70,000 tons of wheat rotting away. Same story in Pakistan, if they had proper grain storage facilities, recent floods couldn't have washed away their entire foodstock. How ironical, Pakistan is begging for food and money from international community while splurging precious resources on "AWACS".

Mr. Ra said...

Pakistan is in an ad-hoc stage of temporary survival. So it is trying to obtain more and more AWACS, JF-17s and F-16s.

We should look in to our requirements from our own comprehensive safety and defense point of view, whatever it is.

Anonymous said...

We must invest more on High Altitude and aerostat balloons based AWACS as these require low fuel and low maintenance. With increasing and ever fluctuating fuel prices we don't have the luxury to fly these birds for long duration of time. There are German, Australian and US firms working on HAA Blimps and balloons. Fitting them with AWACS radar will give us literally an "Eye of Sauron" which can stay up and maintain an unblinking vigil indefinitely at a fraction of the cost of AC based AWACS.

keshto said...

@2:09

AWACS are mobile platforms, there is a data link highway between our fighters and them. They have luxury to patrol our coastal area....something a sitting duck platform (aerostat) dont.

keshto said...

Why landing in Israel instead of India? Did it lose its way?

The Phalcon is running errands in Israel. It is still under trial...

Anonymous said...

@Keshto

High Altitude Airships are not sitting ducks. India i.e. DRDO is working on HAA for AWACS role. :) and so is host of other countries for several other roles like airlifting several M1 tanks in one go to places inaccessible by land, air or sea.

Countries are also working on high altitude balloons which can reach near space limits and remain stationary over a target. Such balloons are beyond the reach of missiles or radar and are virtually invisible to the naked eye. Such balloons will make highly expensive satellites and UAVs almost redundant for spying purpose.

Gautam said...

Any way you look at it, three Phalcons not enough to cover Indian airspace. There's a reason IAF has been asking for 3-4 AWACS(plus at least 9 DRDO AWACS) for years now. Speculating about balloons and super-Phalcon won't satisfy their requirements.

Anonymous said...

@Anon 11:29: Bang on!! but what to do? poor folks are jealous of us and they have nothing 2 to do except visit Indian forums and look at our progress with jealousy- but as many of us have read the saying "Buree Nazar Waley Tera Mooh Kala"!! this is surely for such people. Can't blame them, the pakistanis in Indian forums pretending 2 be Indian are really ashamed of themselves and their banana state- hence they look at indian sites as their country has nothing 2 offer them..no education, only frustration, so atleast on the forums they can feel better about themselves by pretending to be Indian - after all, how long can a nation sustain on alms from other countries..and for those wondering why we are getting Phalcon AWACS at a slower rate than the much much smaller Pakistani AWACS..well we all know a bicycle can be manufactured faster than an ultra modern Phalcon AWACS..!!

Anonymous said...

@Anon 8:43PM

Please provide any solid proof for the balloons which can carry M1s, cause I doubt you have any.

Also, on a side note, even satellites can be shot down using missiles, so any 'balloon' will not be invulnerable to such attacks.

Anonymous said...

@Anon 4.21 AM Kindly do a google search or checkout Airships in Wikipedia.

Shooting down a satellite and balloon are not one and the same thing. It costs 10s of million $ to manufacture and launch a satellite. A high altitude balloon will cost almost nothing to launch and they will be cheaper than the missiles that will be used to shoot them down i.e. if they can be identified in the 1st place.

keshto said...

@ 8:36 PM


High Altitude Airships are not sitting ducks. India i.e. DRDO is working on HAA for AWACS role. :) and so is host of other countries for several other roles like airlifting several M1 tanks in one go to places inaccessible by land, air or sea.

First ask yourself, why did the superpower like the US cancelled the HAA program in the year 2008...

Anonymous said...

@Keshto

Have they? Then what is this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3V5wt9692iU&feature=related

You gotta read this article.
http://www.economist.com/node/17136331
There is no alternative other than lighter than air ships as jet planes are simply too costly due to ever rising crude prices and it's unstable supply due geopolitical condition. If these airships are powered and propelled by solar/hydrogen cells they can literally stay up indefinitely or for a very longtime at a fraction of cost of their jet powered counterparts. These are the perfect heavy lifters and AWACS for any professional armed forces.

Anonymous said...

@Keshto

Check this out. US is very much into Airships for gathering intelligence after all they were the pioneers in this field apart from the Germans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Endurance_Multi-intelligence_Vehicle

Anonymous said...

@Anon 4:58PM

The point that I wanted to make was that balloons are not invulnerable to attacks.

But that was not the principle argument. The argument is that there is no such balloon(which can carry M1s)is in existence. PERIOD.

And I doubt you can show me any credible material to prove that work is in progress on any form of balloon 'transporters'.

The only thing that balloons are good for is aerostat RADARs. All other uses that you wrote about are not there.

Stop watching harry potter and get used to reality, cause it will last longer than 2 hours.

Anonymous said...

To Anonym of 11:29 AM.

I didn't know that you can smell one person to distinguish whether a person is a Paki or an Indian. Then your service is really needed for Indian defense and intelligent establishments to find out the Paki spies or Indian spies working for Pakis. BTW, Sometime back I read a news that Indian Army looking for "specialized dogs" to smell plastic explosives hidden among apple cartons, may be you are suitable for that.

Just by a person's comment you "smelled" that person as a Paki. What an idiot you are! Shiv, how can you tolerate such person. I just wanted to know about the capabilities of our AWACS. We, Indians have a habit of boasting our things unnecessarily and at the same time we degrade our enemy's capability. Paki military may be inferior to our defense forces, but in a war or any skirmish our soldiers are going to be killed even if we are superior to them, but we are not superhumans. At that time we cannot boast, we have had sophisticated PHALCON. India's PHALCON may be good, but I am not sure how good is it when compared with one piece or two pieces of similar items from China. So we just cannot downgrade any Chinese military products just because they are made in China.

Unfortunately, these "boasting" is destroying our country. The US administration knows very well that, Indians will love to hear when others boast their country. These "excessive pride" is spoiling us. No doubt. See the recent incidents on Indian diplomats in different US airports? This happened just one month after US President Obama's visit. These searches may be in retaliation against the snubbing of Obama's press secretary by Indian officials or MEA babus.

Similar incident happened to a Pakistan delegation too. Instead of agreeing, they decided to return to their country. Similarly, when India wins a Gold Medal, it is a BIG news for Indian media. Compared to China, what India won at Asian Games were just a few peanuts.

Again none of these readers who "smell" others as Pakis will be ready to run even a mile. Similarly, I am sure, none of these people who "smell" others as Pakis will be serving the border for India nor ready to take a gun to fight for India.

The Anonym of 12:32 AM.

Anonymous said...

To Anonym of 11:29 AM.

I didn't know that you can smell one person to distinguish whether a person is a Paki or an Indian. Then your service is really needed for Indian defense and intelligent establishments to find out the Paki spies. BTW, Sometime back I read a news that Indian Army looking for "specialized dogs" to smell plastic explosives hidden among apple cartons, may be you are suitable for that.

Just by a person's comment you "smelled" that person as a Paki. I just wanted to know about the capabilities of our AWACS. We, Indians have a habit of boasting our things unnecessarily and at the same time we degrade our enemy's capability. Paki military may be inferior to our defense forces, but in a war or any skirmish our soldiers are going to be killed even if we are superior to them. At that time we cannot boast, we have had sophisticated PHALCON. India's PHALCON may be good, but I am not sure how good is it when compared with one piece or two pieces of similar items from China. We just cannot downgrade any Chinese military products just because they are made in China.

Unfortunately, these "boasting" is destroying our country. The US admin knows very well that, Indians will love to hear when others boast their country. These "excessive pride" is spoiling us. No doubt. See the recent incidents on Indian diplomats in different US airports? This happened just one month after US President Obama's visit. These searches may be in retaliation against the snubbing of Obama's press secretary by Indian officials or MEA babus.

Similar incident happened to a Pakistan delegation too. Instead of agreeing, they decided to return to their country, instead of going full body scan.

Again none of these readers who "smell" others as Pakis will be ready to run even a mile. Similarly, I am sure, none of these people who "smell" others as Pakis will be serving the border for India nor ready to take a gun to fight for India.

The Anonym of 12:32 AM.

Anonymous said...

@Anon 11.00 PM you posted your comment a wee bit too early. Read my last two comments and eat crow.

Anonymous said...

@Anon 12.32AM Pakis smell of garlic whereas Indians smell of garam masala. :)
No need to get annoyed, we people whether Paki or Indi, are a smelly lot. LOL!

Anonymous said...

Like I pointed out earlier, the contention is not airships with sensors for surveillance or aerostat RADARs, the thing I wanted to point out was that no airship to transport equipment like tanks exists.

Read the same thing on the Lockheed airship:

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/products/HighAltitudeAirship/index.html

Anonymous said...

I never disputed the surveillance role, I was only talking about the transport purpose of such airships.

Still no mention of that.

Anonymous said...

Anon 1.27PM,
It seems you don't understand what you read. Checkout that economist link.

Anonymous said...

I missed the economist article.
My bad, you were right.

But I am still not totally convinced of the combat utility of such airships.
I mean the article is talking of hospitals, construction, etc.

And the speed of 45 knots seems too low to defend/run away if attacked.
Also it would increase the time taken for it to deliver materiel. Compared to other transport aircraft like the C-17 which cruise at 450knots.

Nonetheless, you were right.

Anonymous said...

On the positive side of Pakistan trying to compete with India, it keeps the Indian politicians on their toes or they would just go to sleep and think of their own pockets.

As for Pakistan most of what they do is just smoke an mirrors /paint over rust.
Why would a country that size require 4 or 5 awacs when they are cash strapped.

Devaru said...

Couple of things to clarify. The Phalcon platform of AWACS is similar and based on the USAF (American) AWACS system. Israeli Defence Forces and Israeli Defence Industries have very strong relationships. For everyone's information. outside of USA, ONLY Israeli Defence Industries can bid on US Defence Contracts. The Phalcon is superior and is developed in conjunction with the Americans and their Aeronautical and Electronics Defence Industries. Also, the US has given permission(s) to Israeli Defence Industries to provide various sophisticated defence related technologies, to counteract the Chinese and the rogue Pakistanis. Reviewing the Electronics Counter Measures (ECMs) and the Electronics Counter-Counter Measures (ECCM) Technologies, experts would conclusively conclude that the Israeli and the American ECM and ECCM Technologies are highly advanced and superior to other AWACS. The long term Geopolitical/Strategic goal of the west (including the Americans) and Russia is to keep China in check and thwart Pakistan a rogue, violence ridden, and ungovernable nation under check, and prevent it from being a threat to commercial and naval shipping lanes and other interests (economic, political and militarily). A recent example is the pursuit of greater relationship between USA and Mongolia, where gold and platinum reserves worth approximately US $350 Billion has been found. For this reason, the Americans, the West and the Japanese want North and South Korea to become one, isolate China and tame Pakistan. Lastly the sophisticated F-16 and other jets that have been provided by USA to Pakistan, are from past commitments and SPECIFICALLY DO NOT HAVE THE AVIONICS (i.e. aircraft electronics) to go along with. E.g. Radars, Targeting electronics, ordnance and ammunition, etc. Have a good day.