tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post1485213839305929436..comments2023-10-11T17:09:54.975+05:30Comments on LIVEFIST: Ajai Shukla On His Alleged "Turnaround" on the Arjun MBTShiv Aroorhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03510476258643893433noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-3756166471032428622016-01-10T08:52:11.803+05:302016-01-10T08:52:11.803+05:30Mr shukla..as a reader of business standard and wa...Mr shukla..as a reader of business standard and watching you on ndtv shows i had started admiring you and agreeing to your views on most issues..unfortunately after reading your comments against anonymous in the above page...i have to change my views..please apologize in the larger interest...the nation is bigger.Mahesh k Rathihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07192567173330823471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-50185087084570998012010-03-13T03:39:57.803+05:302010-03-13T03:39:57.803+05:30You have tested it and writing form your personal ...You have tested it and writing form your personal experience or you find some information online?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-60173443004438907892010-03-09T01:20:04.381+05:302010-03-09T01:20:04.381+05:30SO GUYS WHAT DO U SAY............ NOW THAT THE WAR...SO GUYS WHAT DO U SAY............ NOW THAT THE WAR HAS BEEN WON. ALL THE YEARS OF HEAR SAY HAS BEEN PUT TO REST BY SHEER PERFORMANCE. I SURE WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FORM ALL THE GUYS WHO LIKE TO TALK ABOUT STUFF IN PAPERS. HAVE YOUR OWN VIEWS AN NOT VIEWS........FROM DONNO WHERE?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03776848278690001309noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-51281625204371551142010-02-20T16:14:20.150+05:302010-02-20T16:14:20.150+05:30I HAVE BEEN FOLLOWING THE COURSE OF THIS BLOG AND ...I HAVE BEEN FOLLOWING THE COURSE OF THIS BLOG AND I HAVE JUST ONE SIMPLE QUERY HOW MANY OF US HAVE DRIVEN/RIDDEN THE ARJUN FOR REAL? I CAN VOUCH THAT ANY ONE WHO HASWILL NEVER MAKE THE MISTAKE OF COMPATING ARJUN WITH ANY TANK......MEANING LET ALONE THE MEDIOCRE T-90 ORTHEPOOR AL-KHALID, ONE WONT COMPARE IT WITH EVEN THE NATO TANKS......ITS MIND BLOWING...........U HAVE TO SEE IT TO BELIEVE IT.......Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03776848278690001309noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-45698452123655759452009-06-10T20:41:17.111+05:302009-06-10T20:41:17.111+05:30I have read this article and it is good but lacks ...I have read this article and it is good but lacks some of the fundamental issues to be addressed, It is not worthy to compare Arjun MBT`s credibility with other tanks, i think there is lot more to be known behind the stage....Please visit http://beginningofcoldwar.blogspot.com for more information and please post comments(it should not be biased)..Indian Love....https://www.blogger.com/profile/04003255913745431988noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-75456060566704677452008-03-20T23:46:00.000+05:302008-03-20T23:46:00.000+05:30"The tank suffers from a hybrid design where sever..."The tank suffers from a hybrid design where several major components have been bought off-the-shelf and slapped together into a tank."<BR/><BR/>Someone please tell the good colonel that the process of taking off-the-shelf subsystems and mating them with other components to form the complete system is called SYSTEMS INTEGRATION and is a part of EVERY MAJOR HARDWARE PROJECT.<BR/><BR/>I don't know what this person is - he may be an expert on armour and whatnot, but one thing he definitely is not is an engineer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-14145919542409199702007-08-29T06:22:00.000+05:302007-08-29T06:22:00.000+05:30Dude, I mean i havent seen such maligned low key y...Dude, I mean i havent seen such maligned low key yello journalist like you, I mean do you know about a tank have you been to an assembly line of tanks before. I mean i donot think you have enough qualification or to that matter experience or even reading knowledge to write. You are lucky man , ideally you should be sued for spreading misinformation and maligning some good work doneesp in case of the arjun something like murali did for bedi.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-58657836748551903062007-07-24T00:10:00.000+05:302007-07-24T00:10:00.000+05:30Ajai so what do I see hear you talking of educatio...<B>Ajai</B> so what do I see hear you talking of education and other qualifications eh.... that from an army man .You should be last man to talk of those so what are you a 12 pass class and got a degree from NDA Oh I know how mock tets are held and people pushed through the courses over there btw how uch did ya pay to get through the SSB ?.You should be the last one to talk of educational qualifications.<BR/><BR/>Hack Ptooth.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-26189039433040131612007-07-20T06:41:00.000+05:302007-07-20T06:41:00.000+05:30Have a look at IPCS-Special-Report-23. It was publ...Have a look at IPCS-Special-Report-23. It was published in June 2006. Reading it, we can understand how unscrupulous our reporters. However, deliberately they have over played the weigh factor of ARJUN in the last one-year itself. <BR/><BR/>They have also provided with a nice comparison chart some one was looking out for. It needs to updated a little bit<BR/><BR/>http://www.ipcs.org/IPCS-Special-Report-23.pdfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-81491508603743444452007-07-10T01:31:00.000+05:302007-07-10T01:31:00.000+05:30Diehard Maverick's comment should have been publis...Diehard Maverick's comment should have been published in a news paper. Alas....<BR/><BR/>Good one Jaidev......<BR/>SandyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-37675384233533104522007-07-02T20:39:00.000+05:302007-07-02T20:39:00.000+05:30Jaidev..many good & thought provoking questions fr...Jaidev..many good & thought provoking questions from you..<BR/><BR/><I>Hybrid design issue: What are the major shortcomings of such a design? and as the earlier anonymous has noted doesnt T-90 have TIs bought off the shelf and God knows what not as hybrid?</I><BR/><BR/>if you ask me, i would say, the choice of a tank designed for russian conditions further modified to Indian conditions is a hybrid one. <BR/><BR/>Having said, I too expect, Ajai Shukla, to expand the theme he is trying to say. As you said, he is one who commandered the Tank segment. So, I too very much interested in seeing the reply from Ajai Shukla. Can Shiv help in this..Will Ajai see our genuine request ?<BR/><BR/>JoeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-48779211478346039502007-07-02T15:46:00.000+05:302007-07-02T15:46:00.000+05:30A request -- let's have serious factual debate, no...A request -- let's have serious factual debate, not another vitiated comments section please! -shiv<BR/><BR/>Now shiv to whom had you requested this? To the anonymouses or to Ajai.<BR/><BR/>Dear Lt. Col. Shukla, Please be civil as I am being to you as well. I havent used any words like nitwits or ignoramus for you. Please keep the respect we have for you intact. And please for God's sake answer the questions instead of trying to get personal with the questioner.<BR/><BR/>Now I am not the same anonymous who wrote above but tell me something about this<BR/><BR/>1)Do helicopters not use infrared imaging for detecting tanks? What matters most then? Profile or bigger IR signature? Are most modern anti tank missiles not IR guided?<BR/><BR/>2)Does T-90 or T-72 have an answer for a helicopter threat which uses IR detection? Does PA not have helicopters which use IR detection? <BR/>Doesnt the use of an APU reduce the IR signature?<BR/><BR/>You said this:<BR/><B>Vulnerable to helicopter, ATGM and tank attack from ranges beyond which it can pick up those enemies.</B><BR/><BR/>Which tank can pick helicopters? Do they have radars for picking helos? <BR/><BR/>about ATGM attacks, can you please tell us what are the ranges of ATGM attacks? and the range of detection by the arjun?<BR/><BR/>Tank attacks? Which tank? What ranges do they have? Again what is the range of detection of tank sized target by the arjun?<BR/><BR/>Will the arjuns and T-90s be not supported by battery level radars? and ALHs with Mistral missiles? or any other SAM battery?<BR/><BR/>What exactly does strategic mobility mean? What it means in terms of cold-start doctrine?<BR/><BR/>Hybrid design issue: What are the major shortcomings of such a design? and as the earlier anonymous has noted doesnt T-90 have TIs bought off the shelf and God knows what not as hybrid?<BR/><BR/><B>You said in the interview that the 2 metre obstacle was beyond other tanks</B>, please note you said it and nobody else, without any apparently or other words. Please tell us is this true? And how much significance does that have?<BR/><BR/><BR/><B>The issue of translating a prototype into a production line remains beset with Quality Control problems</B>.<BR/><BR/>Yes but we have to face this issue isnt it? It wont get solved if we kept shelving the projects right? Until we start manufacturing the products its going to be beset with problems. The way to go about solving this issue is<BR/>1)HAL and Ship dock way: Incorporate the production agency into design house or the design house in the production agency.<BR/>2)ISRO way: Incorporate the production house into the end-user.<BR/><BR/>Keeping OFBs independent is adding another dimension to an already convoluted problem.<BR/><BR/>The DRDO needs accountability and the army needs to be broad-minded about indigenous products.<BR/><BR/><BR/><B>You never mention the changing GSQRs ever. Why is that?</B><BR/>Indeed why is that? what were the GSQRs? What was the target weight? More importantly, Why was is set at that target weight? What is with ground pressure and weight?<BR/><BR/><B>I am asking this to you and to you alone. I dont believe you are a lifafa, whatever that means. Not all of us will be lucky enough to get an experience in tank warfare in Indian context, so please explain to us unlucky ones what you mean? One line answers leave a lot to be explained and as a result lead to misinterpretation by a lot of people</B><BR/>regards<BR/>JaidevAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-42810076654600317412007-06-29T13:09:00.000+05:302007-06-29T13:09:00.000+05:30Indigenous defence research,looking through drdo p...<A HREF="http://frontierindia.net/indigenous-defence-research-looking-through-drdo-prism/" REL="nofollow"><BR/>Indigenous defence research,looking through drdo prism</A><BR/>Dr. Atre himself speaks against the attitude of Army and Air Force.Gopal Suri "aka" Zerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09361977338884022657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-32017141289623449492007-06-27T20:04:00.000+05:302007-06-27T20:04:00.000+05:30And that Shiv,is how you write a technical article...And that Shiv,<BR/>is how you write a technical article when dealing with defense system.<BR/><BR/>Please for god sake please stop using parlimentary reports for basis of any article.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-80519895715076784992007-06-27T17:24:00.000+05:302007-06-27T17:24:00.000+05:30Oh Shukla ji...your nemesis are on the prowl...wat...<B>Oh Shukla ji</B>...<BR/><BR/>your nemesis are on the prowl...watch sorry read this...<BR/><BR/>http://frontierindia.net/arjun-mbt-weight-implications/<BR/><BR/><A><I>The weight of the Arjun MBT is incidental to the Indian Army General Staff Qualitative Requirement (GSQR). Arjun Tank weight arises due to the systems and protection levels as monitored by the Vice Chiefs of Army Staff right from the project inception. Since Arjun Tank project was initiated to match the current western MBT’s, naturally, the Arjun MBT weight will also match them.</I><BR/><BR/>Some senior Indian army officers have the opinion that the Arjun is too heavy for bridges on Indian western border and for the bridging equipment held by the Indian Army Corps of Engineers. We need to look at the Arjun MBT weight issue in a broader perspective, at the entirety of reasons and implications. It has to be analyzed based on tactical and strategic mobility of the Arjun Tank.<BR/><BR/>India busted the myth of the Patton’s in 1965, with Centurions Mk VII which weighed close to 52t. In 35 years gone by, Indian infrastructural woes has caught up with Arjun Tanks too, in addition to not being able to run heavier cost efficient big trucks on the roads and bridges. In comparission to Centurions Mk VII, the Arjun Tank is a mere 7 ton heavier. As the China builds “otherwise” impossible rail and road networks on Indian border to counter a future threat, India has not bothered to make infrastructural improvements to take on current threats.<BR/><BR/>The Arjun MBT is the heaviest tank in our inventory, but that is not a reflection of its agility and gradability. Being powered with a 1400 HP engine, its HP / t ratio is 23.9 which is substantially better than 20.4 of the BMP which is its combat support. <BR/><BR/>Arjun MBT has a bigger track-print, hence, its Nominal Ground Pressure is only 0.84 kg/cm2 which compares well with other MBTs of the world . Further, with a combination of low NGP and high power / weight ratio, it has commendable going ability. The proof being Arjun MBT crossing the Ravi at Lassian, without any engineer support, whatsoever and it has crossed numerous patches of marshy terrain which are marked ‘non-tankable’ in going maps of the Gurdaspur-Pathankot sector.<BR/><BR/>MBT Arjun is broader and heavier than other tanks in our fleet, resulting in special, but not insurmountable, difficulties in transportation. During the last 15 years, various prototypes of Arjun MBT has been moved for trials to various sectors, by both, rail and road, by existing means of transportation, albeit with adhoc expedients, but without facing any serious difficulties.<BR/><BR/>The existing BWTA wagons have pay load capacity of 60+ tons ; the Arjun weighs 58.5 tons. The only issue is that the width of the tank is more than that of the flat and so, the tracks protrude on both sides. A six inch wooden sleepers when placed on the floor of the wagons before loading the Arjun MBT ensures that the tank tracks move over adjacent platforms without fouling with them. With this arrangement Arjun MBT’s were moved as class ‘A’ ODC on Chennai-Delhi, Delhi-Suratgarh, Delhi-Jaiselmer, Chennai-Balasore and Balasore-Delhi lines, on several occasions.<BR/><BR/>In addition, Ministry of Railways, RDSO, Lucknow were approached in 1992 to conduct a feasibility study for rail transportation of MBT Arjun. The study was based on a two pronged approach i.e. design of a new wagon and modification of existing BWTA wagon. The feasibility report was submitted along with all-India broad gauge railway maps showing sectors where the loaded wagon could move as class ‘A’ ODC and the empty wagon could be run as non-ODC. In consonance, the Army HQ, Q Move (Rail) approved both proposals. The RITES / Texmaco team has delivered prototypes of the new wagon for field trials in 2006, it has been proposed that the case for modification to existing BWTA wagons be foreclosed because the population of the new rail wagons can comfortably match the production schedule of the Arjun MBT.<BR/><BR/>On a number of occasions, the Arjuns has been ferried over long distances, on BEML P-80 trailers towed by Tatra Tractors. Of course, in this case also, the tracks of the tank protrude on either side of the P-80 mount, but that is so with even other tanks like T-90S and T-72’s in Indian Army fleet.<BR/><BR/>In December 1994 the DGST sent a copy of their Draft GSQR 636 for a 65 ton trailer to BEML Bangalore who, in turn, have issued their specification for the new trailer which is to be towed by BEML-Tatra T815 VTI 8×8 tractor which is already in service.<BR/><BR/>CVRDE has successfully designed and proven a scissors type 20m, cl 60 BLT (christened Kartik) on the Vijayanta chassis. Another scissors type bridge layer of MLC 70 has been built on the T-72 hull and this also spans 20m. The latest on the anvil is the Arjun BLT with a sliding MLC 70 bridge and a span of 24m. That constitutes substantial initiative and homework on the part of DRDO for trafficability of the Arjun and any other heavy vehicles / equipment. <BR/><BR/>It is true that assault bridging equipment are scarce but are a number of bridging equipment over which Arjuns can traverse without risk. These include the PMP / PMS, MGB, MLAB, Sarvatra, CEASE (60) and the KM (wet type).<BR/><BR/>The issue of “Civil Bridges Over Defence Oriented Canals” is a painfull episode for the simple reason that, when India built ‘defence oriented canals’, we ought to have also planned ‘defence oriented bridges’ on them. Alternatively, we should have upgraded them in requisite sectors which, in any case, is imperative now. It would be quixotic to propose a solution by seeking reduction of the weight of the Arjun to suit vintage bridges!<BR/><BR/>There have been proposals of purning the Arjun MBT weight. Even Indian Army’s opinion is divided over this new, trivial issue which may be referred, perhaps more aptly, as a ‘non-issue’. Yet, in the din which accrues from the gambit of dissent and the consequent ‘unfounded fear of non-acceptance’, panic-driven designers and a section of supporting Users have jointly undertaken a weight reduction exercise ! <BR/><BR/>Several areas of the tank have been identified and targeted for reductions ranging from a couple of hundred kgs to just a few hundred grams! In ultimate judgement, if the cumulative loss is not going to change the bridge classification of the Arjun, the whole effort will have been rendered futile. All attempts at weight reduction must be made conditional, in that, there will be no trade-offs with some other parameters such as levels of protection, structural strength, life expectancy of alternate materials and the ease of handling and maintenance.<BR/><BR/>The Arjun excels the specifics for self-propulsion stated in the GSQR. As for transportation and bridging are concerned, no one in the world designs tanks to suit these means. Instead, civil and military bridges, and the means of rail / road transportation are upgraded to suit new tanks. If Indian Army has problems with the bridges on the defensive canals or assault bridging equipment, its Indian Army’s fault.</A><BR/><BR/>Pasting it in full as this by itself a best rejoinder to Shukla's badmouth on Arjun.<BR/><BR/>-- Diehard MaverickAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-46353400065366332452007-06-27T17:12:00.000+05:302007-06-27T17:12:00.000+05:30>>I am still wondering where the promised report p...>>I am still wondering where the promised report proving the failure of Arjun in Ashwamedh exercise<BR/><BR/>Oh you have to wait till for another reported problem in Arjun, so that it can show the teeth saying "i told you na"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-71959369393123381482007-06-23T14:27:00.000+05:302007-06-23T14:27:00.000+05:30First point,I am still wondering where the promise...First point,I am still wondering where the promised report proving the failure of Arjun in Ashwamedh exercise, is. It has been almost 2 months since the exercise and the apparent promise!<BR/><BR/>Second point it is almost the end of June.... IA still hasn't pitted the Arjun with the invincible T-90. I wonder why?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-65486487809286721122007-06-20T23:46:00.000+05:302007-06-20T23:46:00.000+05:30in my case it is simple. the security restrictions...in my case it is simple. the security restrictions on my laptop with a preconfigured browser- i handle a lot of prprietary financial and technical data make it impossible for cookies to remain more than 1 session. so each time i visit, i have to login and reenter the same shite.<BR/>why bother- id rather sign my name, vivek and be done with it. now colonel blimp is above such things but again, who cares.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-6499299987799354072007-06-20T22:47:00.000+05:302007-06-20T22:47:00.000+05:30Anonymous is the tool used by this twit as an excu...Anonymous is the tool used by this twit as an excuse not to indulge in answering all genuine questions so far.. now he got one more excuse, time..but he has the time to respond to anonymous<BR/><BR/>wht the heck being anonymous..if one prefer not to discolose his identity what will stop him ? Internet provide n number of ways to conceal..these are simple excuses to deny any proper response...<BR/><BR/>dont have any intention of signing my name..what is the use in doing that..Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-64040552946034067992007-06-20T22:27:00.000+05:302007-06-20T22:27:00.000+05:30Ajai,we might be assholes, but we arent simpering ...Ajai,<BR/><BR/>we might be assholes, but we arent simpering pussies. that dubious honor of being a cowardly shoot and scoot prima donna belongs only to u.<BR/><BR/>there are some batchmates of yours who remember you fondly. others regard u as a pompous blowhard who routinely pushed himself as a napolean. the coin incident was narrated firsthand. so ya, it matters how one conducts oneself. perhaps now that you cant pull rank on ur detractors they are more likely to call it as it is. dont get worked up and throw a sissy fit. <BR/><BR/>cheers<BR/>vivek<BR/><BR/>(and retard, i have been signing my name all the while. looks like the asshole is the one who cant read)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-53024369570346909512007-06-20T01:16:00.000+05:302007-06-20T01:16:00.000+05:30Guys,Till now, we did not ask any serious question...Guys,<BR/><BR/>Till now, we did not ask any serious questions !!!!!!<BR/><BR/>We were joking, isn't guys?<BR/>What to say?<BR/><BR/>Don't bang your heads against wall. There is no use.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-45998444063898152442007-06-19T22:58:00.000+05:302007-06-19T22:58:00.000+05:30Hi folks,Even the most cursory eye cast over the r...Hi folks,<BR/><BR/>Even the most cursory eye cast over the responses makes it clear: Anonymous = Asshole.<BR/><BR/>For those who are asking serious questions, I'll post a serious response. Haven't been able to do so yet because I'm busy. If you doubt it, go to NDTV 24X7 at 9 pm tomorrow... or 10 pm on Thursday... and you'll find me anchoring live at that time.<BR/><BR/>But as I said, those who want a serious response on the Arjun issue will find it on my blog... ajaishukla.blogspot.com in a couple of days.<BR/><BR/>And the twits who are going on about "reprimands" and "teaching experts stuff in J&K" are making only one thing really clear: they don't have ANY friends in the army who they can verify my professional reputation from.<BR/><BR/>Until then,<BR/><BR/>Goodbye!Broadswordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13076780076240598482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-27010767727231609832007-06-16T13:24:00.000+05:302007-06-16T13:24:00.000+05:30Alag hai?Alag hai?Gopal Suri "aka" Zerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09361977338884022657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-69544726652348007322007-06-16T11:46:00.000+05:302007-06-16T11:46:00.000+05:30anon @7.07pm,you still dont understand ""tank warf...anon @7.07pm,<BR/><BR/>you still dont understand ""tank warfare in the Indian context"<BR/><BR/>You know its different. Ajai said it, so its different. Thats all. If you dont agree, you will officially be branded among 'boyz-with-toyz' by the powers vested in Ajai by the SC,Constitution by the virtue of his T72 experience.<BR/><BR/>Maggi tomato Ketchup. Its different.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6050542.post-14681978599466995752007-06-16T09:56:00.000+05:302007-06-16T09:56:00.000+05:30Ketchups' cap has been damaged after his T-72 did ...Ketchups' cap has been damaged after his T-72 did a cross country run. His head kept banging against the hatch.His nuts got squeezed in the cramped condition in T-72 tank.<BR/><BR/>His motto seems to be "if your head dosen't bang against the hatch and nuts don't squeez, it ain't tank."Gopal Suri "aka" Zerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09361977338884022657noreply@blogger.com