Sunday, October 09, 2011

Loyalties Switch, Livefist Readers Now Favour Eurofighter For MMRCA!


In yet another poll (left) I posted here a couple days ago, it turns out that the Eurofighter Typhoon is the favoured contender to Livefist's readers, scoring nearly double the number of votes as the Rafale. Weird, because in a similar poll I conducted about five months ago -- shortly after the big downselect -- the Rafale came out on top (see poll on right). Tells you a lot about these polls. :P

38 comments :

Manu said...

The fact that IAF keeps saying in their interviews that there is no restriction on spending in MMRCA deal (considering the fact that EF Typhoon is about 50 percent more costly than Rafale) clearly indicates that IAF favors EF Typhoon over Rafale.

Kiran Kejriwal said...

Clearly Eurofighter's lobbying efforts with Livefist's influential community is undermining our freedoms -- Annaji save us! ;-)

Anonymous said...

I guess you are mistaken.

In the first poll, you asked "Which airplane suits India better ?"

In the second poll, you asked "Which aircraft will India choose ?" => Which aircraft will India buy, irrespective of what suits better.

By equating those questions, you seem to mean/assume that India always buy things which suits better.

If one considers Rafale suits better, it doesn't mean that our Govt buys Rafale. They may buy Typhoon if it's deal is sweeter than Rafale.

Anonymous said...

Paid voters? Rigging? Bottle of hooch?

Anonymous said...

Carrying forward Anonymous1:57PM's argument: We have been seeing the following trend:
1. Jaguar Engine Upgrade supposed to go to Honeywell (USA).
2. Mirage 2000 Upgrade contract given to France.
3. The deal for C-17 Globemaster, C130J going to the US.
4. Many many deals with Russia.

Why do all these results matter?
All the lobbying the world leaders have been doing and India's UN Security Council seat aspirations. So which is the country which is a permanent member of the security council (other than China) which is yet to be appeased? UK.

This was my reason for changing loyalties. This was the same (but independently arrived) conclusion to which another colleague came to. This might be a factor.

Do the others agree too?

Shiv, Which aircraft do you think India will buy?

Looping said...

You said about the strange result:

Shiv Aroor said...

Anon@5.46am: I got an email from a reader mentioning the same thing. Not sure. Have written to polldaddy.com asking them if there's a bug. Will let you guys know. Thanks for the heads-up, though.

so what polldaddy said?

Anonymous said...

The technival évaluation has been made, and now IAF is focussing on the commercial evaluation. We shoud not mixed everything.

But who knows the results of the technical evaluation between the rafale and eurogifhter ?

Anonymous said...

It's a manipulation : the previous poll was hacked.

Rafale was leading and suddenly Eurofighter had +1200 votes and Rafale had lost hundreds of votes.

Anonymous said...

east or west rafale is best

Anonymous said...

it is easy to cheat the pool, i don t tell here how to do, but for somebody knowing javascript/html language, it is easy to do, i can vote 1 million time if i want, but i don't play this game because it is not fair. it is very easy to increase the score for a web developper, if someone want cheat it can do, but this vote make no more sens. Vote quiz without user authentification it is not possible without cheating, you have always somebody want not respect the rule.

Anonymous said...

Please listen to our Airforce personnel, which aircraft they want in their squadrons.

Hope Govt. of India will consider to Indian Airforce recommendation.

Anonymous said...

shiv has been bought by EF...or Rafaele didnt keep their deal :P :P

PS: no offence shiv!! :)

aniket said...

All this polls are ok shiv but wats your take?

Anonymous said...

The deal should go to the company offering unrestricted, conditionless total transfer of technology.

Anonymous said...

Hacked or faked poll as i said to Shiv Aroor by mail.
Some readers and i have the evidences.

During all day (7th) Rafale was leading, but at the end of the day:
22.00 UTC: Rafale= 800
22.01 UTC: Rafale= 600

How it's possible to have negative votes?
After that event,Typhoon'votes increased extraordinary fast!

Shiv Aroor, you know that, but you maintained that poll on line after that very strange results! Why?

syntaxerror9

ArkAngel said...

*sarcasm mode on* Let Anna Hazare choose which bird to buy, obviously he will be right. *sarcasm mode off*

Libra said...

Very interesting indeed....how much do those who voted know about the technical and operational capabilities of these two aircraft?
This isn't quite the competition for the Ms Universe crown...long legs, beautiful smile...
Whilst such polls may boost your trp grades, professionally, they are irrelevant. Thank god the IAF does not have to select a fighter based on uninformed public opinion!

anand raj said...

yeah sir, its kinda weird !! both planes are superb no doubt in it but its upto on IAF. i think atlast india gonna choose RAFALE because india may buy used rafales to fill the gap created by MIG 21s

Anonymous said...

Shiv,
You also seem to assume that the same set of voters answered this question. This is not the case... in fact your sampling has increased from 1649 votes to 2906 votes.... may be the latter is more accurate :). What I would like to know more is why the LCA got delayed and what factors attributed to it. Could you please do a write up on that?
-regards,
JB

Mr. Ra said...

I think this particular poll and/or topic have got hacked somehow.

prs said...

I think many voters shifted to Typhoon because there were rumors that Sonia Gandhi is lobbying for Rafael after taking lot of bribe.

Include me in that list :)

Now a days no one likes corrupt Gandhi family.

Anonymous said...

Rafale was ranked above Eurofighter after the trials, so it doesn't matter. The IAF deserves the best warhorse : Dassault Rafale.

Anonymous said...

Rafale raj

Shiv Aroor said...

ALERT! Ok folks, it turns out that I forgot to switch on the "multiple votes blocker" by IP address AND cookies for this poll. So it turns out there were more than 1000 votes from the same IP address, which polldaddy support said was "suspicious" when I asked them. Think I should put up another poll with cookies and IP address blocker for multiple votes activated?

Shiv Aroor said...

Here's the full mail from Polldaddy support:

Hi Shiv,

1100 votes came from one IP address for the same answer which does appear suspicious. I'm afraid I cannot remove these votes, if you want to do this you will have to upgrade and do it manually through the vote analysis report.

--
Eoin Gallagher | Support
Polldaddy.com

Anonymous said...

Now we have the proof that Eurofighter fanboys are cheaters like the Eurofighter consortium (check the Austrian eurofighter corruption case with google).

This aircraft is really tainted.

Mr. Ra said...

Why go through polls when all you gotta ask is Mr Sengupta and you will get your authoritative answer!Lol

Anonymous said...

if we have 1100 illegal vote with same ip, that give a total 1866 vote
1866-1100=766= 42% for eurofighter
995=53% for rafale
look better and seem logic with previous vote pool in may.
44% for eurofigther
51% for rafale
Rafale get progress of 2%

Danielo said...

You know , it's easy to remove cookies and change ip, nothing can prevent people from voting more than once if they really wants.
That kind of poll is not reliable

anonymous said...

Dear Shiv Aroov,

Considering the fact that the polled was cheated, it would be appriciated that you mention it on your blog or modify your poll comments. If you don't read in the comment sections you are misinformed.

Best regards and keep up the great work.

Anonymous said...

what does mr. p. sengupta says about the best aircraft between the two?

Aaditya Bhatt said...

Rafale is better due to its Spectra Virtual Stealth technology and if we make a deal with France for Rafale, we don't have to spend on assembly line as we have already the assembly line set up for Miraj 2000 at HAL Bangalore facility.

Moreover, Snecma M88 engine can be replaced with GTX-Kaveri engine. For the co-development of the same, MOD is negotiating terms with Snecma.

Rafale is already cheaper than Eurofighter, so I think Rafale will be chosen...

Anonymous said...

I agree, you should really issue an update the story, saying that somebody hacked the poll to favor the Typhoon... It`s easy enough to remove the same-IP votes YOURSELF, and calculate the real result YOURSELF, and can post that in the update.

This type of thing just makes Typhoon fans look pathetic... I mean, the vast majority of them did NOT cheat, or even think of doing so, but this sort of thing just carries a `taint`.

May the lowest-cost L1 bidder win ;-)

Anonymous said...

Dear Shiv,

I think that many people are curious to know if this "IP" is located in Manching or Warton...

Could you help us satisfy our curiosity?

Best,

Anonymous said...

Yeah i've heard the IP address relates to one that the Typhoon consortium uses so is there any chance we can get some confirmation on that or not?

parvas24 said...

India has ordered from all the MMRCA contestants aircraft/ equipment for IAF ... from Russia, USA, UK , France .... except the Swedes...

SU-30MKI , PAK FA ... from Russia ordered.

C130 heavy lift aircraft from USA ordered....

Mirage upgrades from France ordered.

Hawk jet trainer aircrafts from UK ordered....

Swedes are the only ones left out I guess...


I guess in technical evaluation round two birds have been shortlisted:
EF typhoon & Rafale

But in the commerical bid round ... the MOD will study the bids and decide the L1 ( lowest priced and lowest maintance) fighter... probably if the two birds shortlisted are not the L1 ... then the game is wide open and aggressive marketing by the respective companies will be able to clinch the deal... so I still think all the birds have a chance till the Hammer hits the table and the decision by MOD is finalized.

parvas24 said...

Hi Shiv ... please show us on TV network Headlines today .... about thye current situation of MMRCA deal ... also keeping in mind China rapidly mordernizing its airforce....

parvas24 said...

Hi Shiv ...
MiG 21 bisons seem to be falling too often .....wouldn't it make sense for the IAF to return atleast 80% of these jets back to Russia and in return purchase advanced fighter helicopters (Gunships) similar to the APACHE attack helicopters....

If you think it would be a good idea then maybe you could persuade the IAF or the MOD to consider such a move ... that will save our jets and money and get some cutting edge attack helicopters....